Posts by Juan Viejo2

12

Is there a serious weakness in the Watchtower Society's legal position?

by DT in

jw
friends

the watchtower society is good at intimidation.

it uses fear to maintain control of it's members, including fear of being destroyed at armageddon and fear of shunning and being rejected by family and friends.

they even try to intimidate former members by threatening them with lawsuits over copyright issues, as an example.

Juan Viejo2

This situation is exactly what the former elders of the Menlo Park congregation are facing. The Watchtower's representatives can remove them, take over their Kingdom Hall, defame them, falsely accuse them of mishandling KH finances, etc. The Watchtower is essentially stealing the Kingdom Hall. But as the brothers there are finding out, the WT seems to have the advantage because of (1) its seemingly limitless financial resources, (2) its inhouse legal department, and (3) the courts prefer to wash their hands of the dispute because they are afraid that any decisions might fall under the Constitutional ban against not only the abridgment of individuals' rights to religious belief, but also for making laws regulating how religions handle their members.

Advantage Watchtower - unfortunately.

Someday they will slip up and reveal themselves for what they really are: A publishing company running a money-making scam while hiding behind the cloak of religious freedoms and the tax-free laws. They are no different than Jim and Tammy, or Jimmy Swaggart, or Reverend Ike, or Brother Devine, or the "farting TV evangelist" of Dallas, Texas. They are all the same - but the courts don't have the courage or support to really deal with them.

Again, advantage Watchtower.

JV

69

Could ''boredom'' at the Kingdom Hall be one reason why some members leave?

by RULES & REGULATIONS in

you'll find boredom where there is the absence of a good idea earl nightingale quotes (us motivational writer and author, 1921-1989).

let's forget that most members leave due to the wrong beliefs,doctrines and practices of the wts!.

i was bored out of my mind from the repetitive: talks,prayers,ministry school demonstrations,field service talks(peddle magazines),assemblies,special talks and watchtower magazine study articles.

Juan Viejo2

As a JW child of the 1950s, I remember that we had some great "extra-curricular" activities from time to time that really added to my experiences and fond memories.

I was raised in Riverside, CA. There were three (and later four) Kingdom Halls within a 10-mile radius of the downtown area. The city had a great civic auditorium and it was frequently used for circuit assemblies. It was also a great location for special events. For example:

Around 1955, if I remember correctly, one of the brothers from Bethel actually brought out a shortened version of the "PhotoDrama of Creation." It was shown on a large movie theater style screen at the Civic Auditorium. I did not see it again until it appeared on YouTube a couple of years ago. Very impressive. You can see why Russell was so popular at the time and must have gained many converts worldwide as a result of that most magnificent production. The one I saw was tinted (not sure when the tint was added), so you can imagine people in that early period before the first World War being amazed at not only hearing Russell's voice in sync with the movies, but also the fact that they were looking at colored film - possibly for the first time in their lives.

About a year later, a missionary couple came to Riverside and brought movies, slides and recordings with them. Again, the Civic Auditorium was rented and they made their presentation. I remember that their presentation was fun, educational and emotional. I especially remember their recordings of some of the African brothers and sisters singing songs from their version of the Kingdom Songbook - and even a few of their local cultural favorites (something you'd never see now!). Their harmony and skill was amazing. The whole audience stood up and applauded for nearly five minutes after hearing that beautiful music.

I also remember that an occasional brother from Bethel would pass through the area and stop by our Kingdom Hall. Sometimes, after the Thursday night Service Meeting, a visitor would stay over and either speak or answer questions about life at Bethel or Gilead. Families who had to leave could do so, but sometimes the visitor's informal talk would continue until 11 or 11:30 at night. We'd have to leave the area before midnight in order not to violate local noise laws.

I'm sure that some things like this must happen from time to time, but I have not heard of anything quite like what I experienced. Oh, and there is more - but I'll add that later in the thread...

JV

17

Menlo Park Kingdom Hall - Part Deux

by Juan Viejo2 in

this message is important!

timing is critical!.

those of you who have read my previous postings about the lawsuit over the remodel and potential sale of the menlo park, california kingdom hall are aware that i have been trying desperately to contact someone in the area who can help me get more information on this case.. .

Juan Viejo2

I really need a favor from anyone on this group.

If you have a clean copy of the PDF version of the new "Flock" book - or a valid link to a verifiable online link, please PM me ASAP.

I will not reveal your email or anything else about you as the source. It is important that I get a copy for an independent (non-JW connected) researcher.

I have a copy, but can not access it from my laptop and I am 600 miles from home.

I rarely ask a favor (except to reprint a quality posting on my website), but this is really critical.

BTW - I love you guys!!!

JV

18

The Governing Body and the Battle of the Bulge

by metatron in

jw
friends

i once read an excellent history of the battle of the bulge.

it pointed out that hitler took a huge gamble because he knew his forces would be ground down otherwise by advancing allies.

he saw what was coming and rolled the dice............. which may explain what the governing body of jehovah's witnesses is doing: demanding loyalty, attacking college, and trying to intensify shunning.. on the surface, growth looks ok but i believe these numbers are a self deceiving illusion.

Juan Viejo2

I there is a god, maybe he created the Internet to provide Jehovah's Witnesses access to free porn and apostate websites in the comfort and privacy of their own homes.

If all the Internet offered was educational and critical websites discussing the teachings and history of the Watchtower, probably no one would ever bother to search for them.

On the other hand, put free porn on the Internet and untold numbers of JWs (especially elders and Bethelites) would check them out. But after their needs have been met and they are physically exhausted, there are now ex-JW sites and educational sites like TED.com to visit. While their bodily functions recover they can actually be exposed to some of the truths and scandals that they would not see otherwise.

God works in mysterious ways. Maybe some of those elders who go hunting for members of their flocks on Facebook (and to a lesser extent, MySpace), may also note how many they thought were true believers are actually getting exposure to facts about the Watchtower. Maybe by doing that, they too will get some exposure and take the first steps to leaving.

On the other hand, I think that some see the local Kingdom Hall as their only resource for self-glory and control over others. They won't leave no matter what the Watchtower teaches. They probably don't care that it's all bull poopy, irrational, and unsupportable. As long as they actually can be bosses over a group of people they will continue to support the Borg and its worthless religion. The Internet will only be a tool for them to harass and torment their flocks.

123

An Open letter to the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses (Elders/ Ex-Elders)

by stuckinamovement in

jw
friends

if you are an elder or an ex-elder please add a comment.

i hope that the governing body will see this.

it is too bad it has to be on an anonymous forum.

Juan Viejo2

Stuckinamovement... You have a PM.

65

Be honest...What movie star do you look like?

by Botzwana in

jw
friends

i am curious as to what the members here look like.

be totally honest now.

not everyone looks like a knockout or mr. buff.... .

Juan Viejo2

Bill Murray when I was in my 30s - but now more like Brian Doyle Murray (his brother). Oh, well....

76

My Story Part I - My Parents

by Farkel in

part 1 - my parents.

it's a funny thing, time.

notwithstanding einstein's relativity, time means vastly different things throughout life.

Juan Viejo2

I qm 5 years older than you and remember those early years very well. I look forward to reading your story and to see where our stories intersect, as I'm sure they will at some point.

JV

59

Elder wants to do "other activities" with me

by InterestedOne in

jw
friends

i'm fully aware that this is a cult, and i was waiting for the social elements to kick in.

so far, i have just been doing the "bible study," discussing doctrine, etc.

however, recently one of the elders said he wants to get together with me to do other activities.

Juan Viejo2

I repeat what I said earlier: Be careful - very careful.

It's easy to think that JWs are all really nice people, godly, and loving. Nice? Maybe some are. Godly? I know a few that are sincere. Loving? Very, very few that I would put in this category.

If you are just going along to see where it takes you, great. Share your experiences with the rest of us. If you need some coaching, there are dozens of forum members who can provide you with the background information that you'll need.

The Watchtower and Awake! mags love to print article (some obviously bogus) about people who were determined to not get involved and only went along with the person they studied with so as not to hurt their feelings. But "Jehovah came into their hearts and opened their minds..." and the next thing they were full-time pioneers in Belize.

Just keep your guard up...

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